Introduction
Out-of-Combat Play: One reason why you would play a rogue is to have access to a large amount of skill points. If you are playing an adventure where skill-oriented play is important, a rogue is a good way to go. The top class skills available to a rogue are as follows: Acrobatics, Escape Artist, Perception, Diplomacy, Stealth, Knowledge Local, Use Magic Device, Sense Motive and Disable Device. With these powerful class skills a rogue could be an Acrobatic Flank Buddy, Lookout & Scout, Party Face, In the Know Guy, Backup Healer/Mage, and Trapfinder / Trap Disarmer. It would not be hard for you to maximize all of these skills. If you were really trying you could achieve even greater heights as a skill monkey.
- Nitpicking a bit, these skills are powered by a wide range of stats (Dexterity, Wisdom, Intelligence, and Charisma). This makes the skill monkey rogue a somewhat MAD (multi-attribute dependent) proposition. Some other classes like the bard, who can effectively use Charisma for many of his skills (Versatile Performance) and who can add half his level to all knowledge checks (Bardic Knowledge), have abilities to lessen this MAD proposition. Further, these other skill monkey classes are spellcasting classes (bard, investigator, ranger), making Use Magic Device less necessary. With that said, these other classes do not get 8+Int skill points per level.
- Nitpicking a bit more, some skills are required for the class to even function. Acrobatics is required for flanking reliably. Escape Artist is required because your CMD will be low to modest. Use Magic Device is required to remain relevant throughout 13th level in a game so dominated by magic. Finally, Disable Device is socially required because everyone expects for you to take on the task. Accordingly, your skill selection is not as “free-willed” as one would otherwise think. If constructed properly, the designers should have given a rogue 10+Int skill points per level. Maybe even 12+Int because, after all, skills really don’t dominate most Pathfinder games anyway.
In Combat Play: The main reason why you would play a rogue from a combat perspective is for sneak attack damage. The best way to maximize sneak attack damage in the first round of combat is to target an enemy whose dexterity is denied (most likely flat-footed) and without concealment to unload a volley of arrows upon. The problem is that after that first round (short of making yourself unseen or doing something even more novel) you can only get sneak attack on a full attack by flanking and you can only flank with a melee weapon. Therefore, at least to me, the best versions of a combat rogue are the: 1) Unseen Archer; 2) Switch Hitting Bow/ Dex-Based Melee Fighter; 3) Throwing / Melee Fighter and 4) Two-Weapon Fighter. Routes 2 and 3 are so feat intensive that they will likely involve multiclassing, which most notably lowers your skill points and sneak attack damage progression. Routes 1 and 4 can be pulled off without multiclassing with the help of Rogue Talents (Combat Trick & Weapon Training) and maybe being a human. Admittedly, Route 1 requires some Fogcutter Lenses (which your GM may or may not allow you to buy) and which cost 8K.
- Nitpicking a bit, you have to work hard to make a rogue reasonably potent in combat. Second, sneak attack can be countered so many ways (concealment, uncanny dodge, improved uncanny dodge, positioning to avoid flank, creatures immune to precision based damage). Third, rogues are a ¾ BAB class making it hard to land those sneak attacks. Fourth, even without being a spellcasting class, a rogue can be a mechanically difficult class to play. Fifth, absent finding a way to get dexterity to hit and damage, a rogue can be MAD from a combat standpoint requiring Dex, Str and Con. Finding a way to get Dexterity to attack and damage normally involves multiclassing, which most notably lowers your skill points and sneak attack damage progression.
Terrible Saves: Rogues have terrible saving throw bonuses for the two saves stats that matter the most (Fortitude and Will). Further, none of the Rogue Talents address these inherent weaknesses. Therefore, you are going to have to find other ways to address the problem. Multiclassing, Race Selection, Iron Will, Greater Fortitude, Cloak of Resistance with as high an enhancement bonus as you can afford, and whatever else. If not, you are going to have a very risky adventuring lifestyle.
With that said, let’s dive into the Unseen Rogue.
Unseen Rogue Archer Build (Level 1-13)
Race: Obviously anything that gives you a racial bonus to Dexterity. You need it something terrible to have a reasonable chance at hitting. If you can get a bonus to some other stat as well then even better since Rogues are relatively MAD characters. Let’s go with Human because of the extra feat, extra skill points, and favorite class ability. Further, I have never seen a GM disallow a Human as a race.
Archetype (Sniper): You increase the range for your sneak attack to 70 feet and have a legitimate reason for not disarming traps – you can’t.
Favorite Class Ability: +1/6 Rogue Talent
Stats (20 points): Str (14); Dex (18); Con (14); Int (12); Wis (12); Cha (7). If only playing to 13th level, put stat increases in Dex, Dex, Cha.
Traits: Reactionary, Indomitable Will
Feats / Rogue Talents: 1) Point Blank Shot (level feat), Rapid Shot (human feat); 2) Weapon Training (Longbow Composite) (rogue talent); 3) Precise Shot; 4) Sniper’s Eye; 5) Deadly Aim; 6) Minor Magic (Ray of Frost), Major Magic (Obscuring Mist) (favorite class bonus rogue talent); 7) Arcane Strike; 8) Combat Trick (Clustered Shots); 9) Manyshot; 10) Hunter’s Surprise; 11) Iron Will; 12) Feat (Improved Iron Will), Improved Evasion; 13) Greater Fortitude.
Alternative Builds: Below are some alternative builds if you are willing to fly by the seat of your pants concerning saving throws. Also, maybe your GM’s style makes saving throws less important (i.e. your GM uses Hero Points and dishes them out like crazy or your GM does not use saving throws against the players often).
- Alternative Snapshot Build: 11) Snapshot; 12) Feat (Improved Snapshot), Opportunist; 13) Combat Reflexes.
- Alternative Physical Defense Build: 11) Improved Unarmed Strike; 12) Feat (Snakes Fang), Improved Evasion; 13) Deflect Arrows.
Skills (130 points): Perception (13), Acrobatics (13), Escape Artist (13), Diplomacy (13), Stealth (13), Knowledge Local (13), Use Magic Device (13), Sense Motive (13). You have 26 points left to do with as you will. Maybe invest in Handle Animal (see Optibuilds’ Skills PDF Part 1)
Equipment: Fogcutter Lenses (8K) – Pick up some at 7th level; +4 Cloak of Resistance (16K) – Keeping this high as you level is a must because of your low saves; +3 Adaptive Longbow Composite (19K); +4 Mithril Chainshirt (16K); +4 Dexterity Belt (16K); Ring of Force Shield (4K); +2 Ring of Protection (8K); +2 Amulet of Natural Armor (8K); Bracer’s of Falcons Aim (4K); Efficient Quiver (1.2K);+2 Headband of Wis/Int (10K); Winged Boots (12K); +2 Rapier (8K) – for when fighting melee is advantageous, like when the creature has DR/slashing, you are flanking, and you have not got Clustered Shots yet or the Bow is broken.
- Arrows: (Silver x20, Blunt x20, Cold Iron x20, Adamantine x20, Standard Piercing x50) – The only damage reduction you won’t have an answer for is DR / Slashing and DR/-, until you get Clustered Shots that is. Even once you get Clustered Shots, using the right arrows will still add additional damage. You should purchase these arrows as durable arrows or have a mage use mending to repair your arrows.
- Wands: You have 14K left to buy wands and scrolls. I would focus on first level wands. Some obvious selections would be Cure Light Wounds, Protection v. Evil (2nd Level Caster), and Shield (2LC) for starters.
Dexterous Switch Hitter (coming soon)
Two-Weapon Fighter (coming soon)
Throwing Melee Fighter (coming soon)
Nice guide, waiting for the build of two-weapon fighter
Me too
A new unarmed fighter style PDF featuring several two weapon fighting unarmed fighters will be coming soon. The DPR on the top build will be 700+ for a single round of combat.
I replied here about this previously (on a page focused on an archer rogue), but you can’t take Arcane Strike unless you’re an arcane caster and having a spell-like ability does NOT make the rogue an arcane caster. (At least, not by Pathfinder Society rules, which you might think of as the “ultra-strict” set of rules.)
I’ve built a monk/rogue(unchained) archer that is turning out pretty cool. I’m playing her now and we’re at 6th level, but I’m looking forward to another 2-3 levels to really get into her stride!
Yes, you are right, but this build was made long before that ruling came out. I will get around to updating the build. Until then, anyone seeking to use this build should modify it accordingly.
This is fine, detailed writing, and I look forward to your next builds. Thoughts:
1) Equipment:
a) Aspect of the Falcon has been nerfed since this was published, making the bracers based on it less desirable.
b) Blanch (silver, adamantine, & ghost touch) on cold iron arrows is far cheaper than buying specialized arrows.
c) If you know you might face trouble in the next 4 hours, alchemical grease is so cheap (5 g.p.) & helpful (+5 to Escape Artist) that there’s little reason to ever not wear it.
d) The best buy my rogue ever made was a pair of Deliquescent Gloves; not only do they add 1d6 acid damage to any ranged or melee weapon, they allow a melee touch attack (and any sneak attack that comes with it). There is a fire version of the gloves too, and a Rod of Ice also allows the touch attack.
e) A Ring of Ratfangs or Mammoth Helm allows a natural attack (potentially with sneak attack damage).
f) Dropping a smoke pellet allows a rogue to use Stealth to find concealment.
g) Why wouldn’t an archer or rapier-user wear a buckler? If it’s masterwork, there’s no drawback but weight.
2) I disagree with some of your wand recommendations. PfE and Shield last only a minute or two, and by the time your UMD is good enough to consistently make the check immediately before combat, those spells’ bonuses are largely outdated. But even a modest UMD bonus allows Longstrider (+10 speed), Heighten Awareness (Improved Initiative for cheap), and Blend (if you’re an elf), though, and Feather Step and Negate Aroma sometimes help. A reliable UMD bonus makes Inflict Light Wounds, Chill Touch, Shocking Grasp, or Acid Splash (no SR allowed) available for touch attacks, and Longarm, Gravity Bow/Lead Blades, or Aspect of the Falcon wands offer sound buffs. CLW is also good against undead. Touch of Idiocy could be a nasty touch de-buff.
3) Even if she can’t see through fog with a Gaz Mask, Obscuring Mist still grants a rogue concealment (and thus Stealth and sneak attack) for a) lurking in the mist’s fringes and shooting targets outside of the mist and b) playing cat-and-mouse against foes within the mist. A problem is that her nearby allies might not appreciate the fog as much. Since a higher caster level doesn’t help much, I would later retrain this Major Magic choice (into Vanish, Chill Touch, or Shocking Grasp?) if I ever got it in the first place.
4) The Twist Away feat improves Fortitude saves tremendously, albeit at the cost of staggering for a round.
5) My own rogue’s build revolves around Strength damage. Useful choices: Major Magic: Ray of Enfeeblement or Chill Touch, Ninja Trick: Pressure Points, Crippling Strike, Summon Shadow (from a 3-level dip into Shadowdancer, which also grants Hide in Plain Sight), and perhaps Bonebreaker Bracers.
Thanks, and keep up the good work!
Good enough for crudest basics, but disregard for the leadership feat means that it remains low-brainer hack & slash crap (typical adventures, not all players play a rogue for fun & profit)?
any progress on two weapon fighter?
Is this site dead? Any update on that Two-Weapon Fighter Build